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Por S0urceror

Master (204)

Imagen del S0urceror

19-07-2021, 08:58

mars2000you wrote:

It is different from new MSX2+ based on FGPA, because it is based on Raspberry PI 3B+, which is a computer itself.

Yes MSXVR is emulating the MSX1/2/2+/TR on a RPI3B. But it also goes further in that it has it's own specialised hardware to allow cartridges, joystick ports, HDMI, USB, wifi, ethernet, etc. On top of that it has it own DOS, BASIC, SCRIPT that go beyond what the MSX ever did. As a result it became the MSX that never was. And therefore, difficult to pinpoint into one category.

mars2000you wrote:

Maybe also a FGPA category as sub-category of the Emulation category, just because FGPA is actually hardware emulation.

Having done FPGA's myself, on the DE10-NANO, I know that after programming a FPGA the chip starts electrically behaving as the real piece of hardware. Down to the microsecond level in 1's and 0's. This is not hardware emulation it is hardware re-creation in today's chip form-factor. Again difficult to pinpoint where it sits.

Anyway, I focus on the MSXVR for now. Let's first add some content in the current place. Afterwards we can always move it to any category we believe it should be.

P.S. The 1-chip-MSX currently sits under MSX2/2+ categories

Por gdx

Enlighted (5491)

Imagen del gdx

19-07-2021, 10:05

S0urceror wrote:

Yes MSXVR is emulating the MSX1/2/2+/TR on a RPI3B. But it also goes further in that it has it's own specialised hardware to allow cartridges, joystick ports, HDMI, USB, wifi, ethernet, etc. On top of that it has it own DOS, BASIC, SCRIPT that go beyond what the MSX ever did. As a result it became the MSX that never was. And therefore, difficult to pinpoint into one category.

I don't see much difference with OpenMSX which would have a good MSX cartridge adapter. The integration is more extensive but overall it stills the same. I was a little hesitant to do an MSXVR categories but since it's something different from the MSX I prefer to leave the choice to people. Do they want us to talk about the specifics of MSXVR on MRC? There is already a dedicated MSXVR discussion thread. I don't know if it's enough or not.
Otherwise, OpenMSX has its own section in the forums. Why not add a section for the MSXVR, if there is demand.

S0urceror wrote:

The 1-chip-MSX currently sits under MSX2/2+ categories

Because the FPGA chip electrically behaves as the real piece of hardware when properly programmed. These devices directly boot on the MSX system without going through an intermediary.

Por mars2000you

Enlighted (6221)

Imagen del mars2000you

20-07-2021, 12:19

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Por Manuel

Ascended (18783)

Imagen del Manuel

06-04-2022, 09:16

Is there already an overview of all the Pause keys that were used on MSX systems, and how they work and whether or not they can be circumvented by software (and if so, how)?
I couldn't find it and it would be very nice.

Por ducasp

Hero (550)

Imagen del ducasp

06-04-2022, 17:25

S0urceror wrote:
mars2000you wrote:

Maybe also a FGPA category as sub-category of the Emulation category, just because FGPA is actually hardware emulation.

Having done FPGA's myself, on the DE10-NANO, I know that after programming a FPGA the chip starts electrically behaving as the real piece of hardware. Down to the microsecond level in 1's and 0's. This is not hardware emulation it is hardware re-creation in today's chip form-factor. Again difficult to pinpoint where it sits.

Anyway, I focus on the MSXVR for now. Let's first add some content in the current place. Afterwards we can always move it to any category we believe it should be.

P.S. The 1-chip-MSX currently sits under MSX2/2+ categories

This is partially true... Since the VDP was developed through a "black box" approach and not through having access to a decaped VDP, it is not cycle accurate, neither is perfect... It can be updated to be "nearly" accurate though, and I believe KdL and Hara-san are working on it, but to be 100% accurate and not an emulation, that would be something else. At this point, in my oppinion, it is fair to say it is an emulation, at least the VDP, not sure about T80 and other parts, but VDP is trying to emulate a 9958, not a perfect replica. It has an advantage of being an emulation using logic/hardware and thus parallelism is similar to a real 9958, which Software emulation has a hard time recreating, and perceived input lag, if using analog video output, is akin to real hardware.

It is a deep subject, but not all FPGA implementations are a hardware 1:1 copy, and MSX VDP is on of those that is not 1:1, good enough for most purpouses, less input lag perceived, but it is less accurate than OpenMSX 9958 emulation as an example... Wink

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