One chip MSX improvement project

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Por HRA!

Champion (274)

Imagen del HRA!

07-05-2008, 13:19

Por KdL

Paragon (1434)

Imagen del KdL

07-05-2008, 13:44


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- MSX 20th Anniversary Demo (red-white dancer screen)

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It is PAL Monitor only. (VGA Monitor is not supported.)

Memo:
The VGA monitor output compulsorily becomes NTSC mode.
Because the VGA monitor is 60Hz.
It is an extra that the software only for PAL moves by the VGA monitor.
Interchangeability is unwarrantable.

...mmmh?! with original VDP model of OCM-PLD v2.2b it work fine with VGA Monitor at 60Hz forced... why??

Por HRA!

Champion (274)

Imagen del HRA!

07-05-2008, 14:13


...mmmh?! with original VDP model of OCM-PLD v2.2b it work fine with VGA Monitor at 60Hz forced... why??

In OCM, there are a variety of timing bugs.
Working with VGA Monitor is not necessarily correct.
(Working with VGA Monitor might be correct.)

VGA Monitor mode is a function not provided in genuine MSX.

Por MicroTech

Champion (385)

Imagen del MicroTech

07-05-2008, 15:02

@ HRA! & D-Tail:
I think "BD technology" can improve performances in applications (demo/games) which make massive use of vdp command engine.

I'm thinking to a game in which 2 video pages are used (I'm actually working on it but these considerations can be extended to any similar application).
During a "frame period" cpu has to:
1) show display page
2) prepare active page:
2A) clear active page
2B) calculate 3D transformations
2C) translate 3D primitives to 2D primitives
2D) prepare (queue) corresponding vdp commands
2E) feed vdp with queued commands (here cpu wastes lot of time waiting vdp to become ready)
3) wait vdp/syncronization, swap active/display page, goto 1

Even "pipelining" the code (steps 2B, 2C, 2D prepare a frame while step 2E works on data related to the previous frame) cpu spends time to poll vdp and code results constellated with call to the poll routine.
Although this could be avoided with the "interrupt on end of command" feature, I think cpu would still spend lot of time to enter/exit from isr (in my scenario a frame is rasterized with 200 vdp commands).

Por HRA!

Champion (274)

Imagen del HRA!

07-05-2008, 15:16


I think "BD technology" can improve performances in applications (demo/games) which make massive use of vdp command engine.

It is a new feature.
It doesn't enter in free LE capacity of OCM.
If it is "ALTERA DE1", it might be possible.

"quick" also destroys interchangeability.
It is necessary to add it as another mode to maintain interchangeability.
It is invalid in default.


2B) calculate 3D transformations

oO

If it wants to do 3D, you should use PC.

Por KdL

Paragon (1434)

Imagen del KdL

07-05-2008, 15:35

new tests:

DIX -> black screen at 50Hz and 60Hz
Sonyc -> from island map freezed it continue to work on VGA60 when you press PrintScreen for 4 step (!)
MSX 20TH Ann.Demo -> as Sonyc: from red-dancer screen freezed it continue to work on VGA60 when you press PrintScreen for 4 step (!)

ps. with non-VGA60 screen Sonyc and MSX20TH Ann.Demo works

Por HRA!

Champion (274)

Imagen del HRA!

07-05-2008, 16:12


press PrintScreen for 4 step (!)

[PrintScreen] switches PAL/NTSC/VGA.
It begins to advance when changing into PAL.


DIX -> black screen at 50Hz and 60Hz

It advances when [Puase/Break] is hit repeatedly oO
RuneMasterII too.

It freezes it though DIX is simple (R#19=80h) scanning lines interrupt.
The cause is not understood.
Interrupt bug Eek!

Por MicroTech

Champion (385)

Imagen del MicroTech

07-05-2008, 17:23

It is a new feature.
It doesn't enter in free LE capacity of OCM.
If it is "ALTERA DE1", it might be possible.

That's a pity Shocked!
Hope European/limited-edition 1chipMSX will use a "larger" fpga... if it will ever be produced Eek!

If it wants to do 3D, you should use PC.
Actually I get 10 fps on a TurboR even in the "worst" condition... Hannibal

Por SaebaMSX

Hero (533)

Imagen del SaebaMSX

07-05-2008, 18:26

That's a pity Shocked!
Hope European/limited-edition 1chipMSX will use a "larger" fpga... if it will ever be produced Eek!

And who in Europe was going to develop new stuff for that bigger OCM? Tongue

Por HRA!

Champion (274)

Imagen del HRA!

08-05-2008, 16:51


Actually I get 10 fps on a TurboR even in the "worst" condition...

It is cool to do 3D with genuine MSX.
However, can you say it is cool even if 3D is done with OCM that adds 3D Acseraration?

Enough consideration is necessary to add an original function to OCM.
The new feature is not worth achievement if a lot of people's agreements are
not obtained.
Because there is no existence value if software that uses it doesn't appear.
I do not oppose putting the new feature.
However, I think that it is dangerous to put the new feature easily.

The LogicElement(LE) of OCM is 12060LEs.
EMSX_TOP of the latest version on OCM consumes 11447LEs.
It is also difficult for OCM to give complete interchangeability.

The LE of "ALTERA DE1" is 20000LEs.
EMSX_TOP of the latest version on DE1 consumes 10059LEs.
In DE1, there is still space.

I will change the main target to DE1 when doing a little more.

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